This week we focus on the Holy Spirit. Here are a few passages to get you started:
John 14:16-8, 26-7
And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever – the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you.
But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.
John 15:26,27
When the Counselor comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father, he will testify about me. And you also must testify, for you have been with me from the beginning.
John 16:5-15
"Now I am going to him who sent me, yet none of you asks me, ‘Where are you going?’ Because I have said these things, you are filled with grief. But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned. "I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you."
What do you think about when you think about the Holy Spirit?
What is your experience with him?
About Me
- Allen
- Mitchell, Indiana, United States
- I love my family, and I enjoy what I do. I am in my 18th year with the Mitchell Church of Christ. I am an endurance athlete. The parallels between endurance athletics and ministry are remarkable. They are mutually beneficial.
The Holy Trinity
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20 comments:
So how's it going?
I have a lot of things going on, and I think I'll start sharing some of this with you in this place.
I am still adjusting to our new situation at home. Lester is more or less permanently gone, which is good. He is doing well and has a wonderful wife. I could not be happier for him/them. They came home yesterday, and it was so good to spend some time with them last night and today.
Luke is doing well at Lipscomb. I miss him so much, but I couldn't be happier for him. He already changed his major from Pharmacy to Engineering, which makes a great deal of sense. Luke is an engineer through and through.
Things are a little busy this fall with Rebecca playing volleyball and Ben playing football. Neither can drive, so Kedra and I make lots of trips to town.
Happy Labor Day!
What are you doing today? Or, if you are reading this on Tuesday, what did you do yesterday?
My plans have changed for today.
I am going to work at ReGeneration some this morning. Today is the day we’ve been waiting for for many weeks. Today the door way is being cut which will allow us to connect the present store with the building next door. We are going to expand the store considerably in the next 2-3 weeks.
This has been a big project. Cutting through the wall of a 100 year old building scared several people off, but Charles C. agreed to do it. He is doing a great job. Once the hole is cut (today) we will begin a push to finish the remodeling. We hope to have everything in place before the Persimmon Festival.
I am sitting here watching hurricane Gustov coverage. You have heard me say this several times: I would love to ride out a hurricane somewhere sometime. BUT I would not want to be one of those stupid reporters who stand outside in it. What's with that?
I would love to ride out a hurricane as well, my wife thinks I am a nut but to see all of that power... wow. I am enjoying the day at home. Have a good time a Regeneration, sounds fun, powerful tools cutting out walls. Pat Arthur
Charles did a great job with cutting the doorway to connect ReGen with the building next door. I spent a significant part of yesterday up there helping to control dust. It was a small price to pay to expand the store. Soon we’ll make a push to finish the connection; we’ll need lots of volunteers.
Today is going to be a very busy day. Tuesday mornings are my primary study time, so I hope to spend a few hours with John this morning. This afternoon I will visit with food pantry people, inviting them to a Bible study that I am going to start next week. I invited about 50 people last week, and I’ll probably get to invite about that many today as well. I am hoping and praying that we can develop a good core group of people who will study each Tuesday. I’ll have more to say about all this in the future.
We are also trying to line up a mission trip to Mexico or somewhere else in Central American next summer. Finding a place to go is not as easy as I thought it would be. Two works that I was interested in have several regular teams already going, and it seems that it is hard to find a week to work with them. We have some other leads. We hope to take a diverse team from MCOC. Some would do construction work, and others would play/work with children. There would be lots of different things to do for everyone, depending upon tasks and talents.
So do you talk to yourself often? I find it quite entertaining to see you talk to yourself on here. I am intensely interesting in the mission trip to Mexico or C.A. or anywhere else you decide to go. I am hoping to go to Costa Rica or Myanmar this winter with another group, so I'll have gotten my feet wet by next summer. Construction skills are my speciality! Keep me in the loop if you can brother. Jason Petty
Hey Jason! Yes, I often talk to myself, and what does it say that I want others to read it? Hmmmm
I would love to have you as a part of a team. We'll see what develops. Keep praying for good discernment for us all as we strive to determine/follow the will of God.
I am working my way through John 14-16 this morning. Powerful stuff! So much stuff!
What about this?
John14:27
Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.
And then what about this?
John 15:13-16
Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends. You are my friends if you do what I command. I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master’s business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you. You did not choose me, but I chose you and appointed you to go and bear fruit—fruit that will last. Then the Father will give you whatever you ask in my name.
I am a friend of God. Reminds me of the contemporary Christian song of the same title. When I was in Istanbul, at the end of my nearly month long trip, I walked a long way to worship with an international, English speaking church. [You can read my post about that here.] During that time of worship we sang this song. It was amazing! I remember tears in my eyes as I contemplated the thought of being God’s friend.
I've thought a lot more about the Holy spirit over the last few years. I truly believe in it, but I probably have more questions than answers.
I've always felt like the Holy Spirit will only lead us as much as we let it.
I aso believe that it's the Holy Spirit that moves me to act when I hear certain announcement or need that I know I can impact.
It's interesting that this came up this week. It was 3 years ago that I was really moved to help Curt Day drive one of the campers to Baton Rouge, LA after hurricane Katrina. I heard Allen announce the trip and I kept thinking to myself. "How can I help beyond giving food donations?" I still don't know if I was much help, but it made an impact on me. You can't understand the need until you see 10,000+ campers that will be people's permanent homes for months and years to come.
Thankfully, it looks like God and Gustav spared them this time.
Brent
here is a question probably more than a thought. we touched on this in class a bit on sunday.
here we referenced this "being" or "power" as the HOLY spirit. In doing so, are we identifying this spirit from other "spirits" at work in our lives? Is there a "non-Holy" spirit? In accepting this and acknowledging so, are we also acknowledging that there really is a spirit world at work in the world today?
Like Brent I often wonder how much we really let the holy spirit work in our lives. do we ignore or not hear it?
RR
I like RR's thoughts on the spirit world. It is something a lot of people read in scripture but have a hard time making this a reality that affects the world around us and within us. Just because we feel moved doesn't mean it is in the right direction. Our filter must always be God's Word and prayer. Let it move you for sure, but be humble enough to understand that we aren't stronger than any spiritual force, for good or evil. The Holy Spirit works best as a Counselor, the "Interpreter" of God's Word, not as our conscience or some chilly feeling up our spine.
The goal for all of us should be to love the Lord our God with all our heart (emotion), soul (morals), strength (body), and mind (intellect). We are all wired differently, but don't allow one of these to become overly dominant in your life. If it is, question whether this is the HS or something else before acting.
Good posts, guys!
Here are some interesting passages for us to consider:
1Corinthians 2:12
We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.
Ephesians 2:2
. . .in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.
1 John 4:1-3, 6
Dear friends, do not believe every spirit , but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist , which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world. We are from God, and whoever knows God listens to us; but whoever is not from God does not listen to us. This is how we recognize the Spirit of truth and the spirit of falsehood.
Romans 8:15
For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear , but you received the Spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, “Abba,Father.”
How do these fit into the conversation?
I’m sorry this post is off topic for the week, but I’m really struggling with some of the media coverage of the election. As Christians, what guidance does the Bible give about choosing candidates for public office? There are several passages that tell us how to choose leaders of the church, but I’m pretty sure none of the candidates would meet those criteria. Which principles should be most important when you agree with a candidates view on some issues, but not others? Or when they say something that you don't really believe is true? I’m feeling really jaded about the whole situation—I want to give people the benefit of the doubt that they mean the things they say, but that can be really difficult.
I’m really embarrassed to admit this, but I find myself considering some of the talking head arguments about whether Sarah Palin has enough time to spend with her children if she becomes the vice president, even though I’ll be the first to admit that I should be asking the same question of male candidates. Or maybe worse, I’ve been thinking about the arguments that she isn’t really committed to moral values because her daughter is pregnant. I don’t have children, but I know I screw up every day, and my parents certainly couldn’t prevent all the mistakes I’ve made, especially when I was 16 and thought I knew it all. Do we even have a legitimate right to make judgments about these issues, or about whether the candidates are telling the truth? How should a Christian separate the talking points from the truth?
I’m most troubled by the comments I see in some blogs that are negative about Christians that say Palin’s daughter’s pregnancy proves that Christian and conservative values are outdated, or that Christians don’t “practice what you preach”, or they’re all “holier than thou”. I wish it were easier to convince the world that we’re not hypocritical, but some days those are the same issues that hurt my own Christian walk. How do we change those perceptions?
I like your latest passages. I Corinthians talks about the Holy Spirit and his ability to interpret the law of Christ for us so we can understand the gift of grace. Ephesians discusses the spirit of evil at work in the world today. Romans 8 talks about the transition from one to the other. But unfortunately our lives aren’t black and white. The traditional thinking says once we are baptized and do the right things in the right ways at the right times, we are saved, and God does the rest for us. The reality is that everyone of us continues to struggle with these forces, and holding a watered-down view of the gospel limits the power of the Holy Spirit. Remember though that Paul dealt with this and discussed it openly in Romans 7. We should learn from his example and not hide our problems. When we put on the happy face at the door of the church building, we stifle the Holy Spirit because our hearts are not truly open to be pierced and receive the truth.
I John 4 is the best example of this at the time of the letter. He instructs the churches to test the spirits. The reference he alludes to are the Gnostics, who believed Christ wasn’t in the flesh but a spirit form because they believed the spirit to be good and the flesh to be evil, thus Christ couldn’t have been flesh if he were without sin. The example discussed here applies to us in different ways today. If the truth is taught and “believers” are unwilling to see it for what it is in order to stay loyal to the false teachings or traditions or their sinful lifestyles, these unfortunate urgings are the evil spirits within us fighting to take hold again. They are crafty, much more than we are. Absolute trust in the Lord is so much more critical in light of this thinking.
Wow, more good posts! Thanks.
First, the political stuff. I am really wrestling with my involvement with politics, trying to sort out the “render unto Caeser and render unto Christ” stuff. I have always voted and probably will continue to do so. The Bible speaks of the Christian interface with government in a few places. The message is fairly clear: pray for and honor the government, obey the laws of the land, etc. (unless of course the law would cause us to disobey God).
What do we look for in political leaders? You are right that most would not live up the “qualifications” of church leaders. And I think most of us would say that they don’t have to, but having said that, I think we are still looking for some of same, core things: integrity, honesty, and character.
There is a shift in Christian thought about politics, I think. Used to it was automatic that most (at least Evangelical) Christians would vote republican because of the party’s stance on abortion, euthanasia, homosexuality, etc. I think what is happening now is that some Christian folks are saying that social justice issues are even more important than those mentioned above, and therefore there is a move among some Christians to vote for democrats.
What do you think of all that?
I think I want to focus on the Kingdom of God and do what I can to bring about justice. I want to serve the poor in anyway I can. That’s why I am involved with ReGeneration and our food pantry and the Bryantsville Hunger Relief Project [BHRP] among other things, and that’s why I want to begin leading mission trips to Central America or Mexico.
If you want to go a little deeper with all this, then study the concept of Christendom or Constantinianism. There can be a very unhealthy relationship between the church and government, which leads to confusion and compromise. I’ll just leave it at that for now.
I will vote this fall, and my decision will be based on my upbringing, my lifestyle, moral concerns, etc., but as I vote I hope remember that someday all this will pass. The only thing that survives will be God’s work and his people.
Oh, I almost forgot. I find all the media coverage about Bristol Palin absolutely sickening.
P, I love having your comments!
You are so right about being transparent and authentic. We are all messed up and struggle daily, which by the way is a good sign/thing. Right? It’s in our struggles that we find our reliance on God most obvious. I am thinking of 2 Cor. 12, and your citation of Romans 7 (leading into Chapter 8, which about the Spirit) is an excellent example also. We can get so burdened that the Spirit intercedes for us with groans.
In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groans that words cannot express.
[Romans 8:26]
Something you said in a previous post is so important also: we cannot leave the Word behind. This is the Spirit’s greatest tool. Sometimes people talk of “being led by the Spirit,” and what they are led to contradicts Scripture. That can’t happen in my mind. They are being mislead by another kind of spirit (see above).
Let me ask this in regard to the Spirit:
Do you think the Spirit of God works in different ways with different people, personality types, talents, etc.?
I really enjoy this discussion on the Holy Spirit. I hope we aren’t the only ones reading this! Things always seem to work out much smoother and for the better when we aren’t alone. Friends and family are a great temporal way to achieve togetherness, but the Holy Spirit in our lives can open our eyes to the great cloud of witnesses that surround us at all times.
The Holy Spirit definitely works in people’s lives in different ways. I think it is a sad commentary to hear some folks try to stifle certain parts of our personality for the sake of a “structured worship”. An orderly worship is important, because we are there to give glory to God and praise Him first. But we must be careful not to use I Corinthians 14 as a proof text to stifle the spirit. Here I don’t necessarily mean the Holy Spirit. If the Spirit of God is in us, we allow Him to lead us, and that puts us in control of our spirit (our life breath, the good and evil sides of us). See I Corinthians 14:32. I have come to believe that our pre-arranged, “can’t be changed without approval” way of worship limits the power of the Holy Spirit because it stifles the spirit of some of our brethren. Do I believe people still speak in tongues? No I don’t, but that doesn’t mean the Holy Spirit can’t do it. I just don’t think the need is there. And that is the key.
The Holy Spirit gives to each of us gifts so that we can help each other meet needs and grow spiritually (I Cor. 12:7). It is God who does the work in each of us. These gifts should all be working together for the good of God’s children and the glory of God. Speaking, teaching, praying, smiling, fixing meals, a gentle heart, leading worship & praise songs, a shoulder to cry on, the passion of different races, the perspective of different ages, the list goes on. But what began as a genuine worship of the one true God in the 1st century turned into a mandatory action in the time of Constantine (the Holy Roman Empire) and into ritual by the mid-first Millennium. The Reformation and subsequent New World voyages were a good attempt to get back to the gospel, but the man-made traditions had taken root without people realizing it. The Holy Spirit still worked in many people to accomplish the work of the church, but not as far-reaching into our own hearts as God would have.
Today we realize this sad history and try to recognize and let the Holy Spirit work, but we must be careful not to constrain Him to OUR rules of worship. The New Covenant is about freedom from sin and the regulations of sacrifice, so why do we do ourselves a disservice by creating new rules and regulations through proof-texting and mis-understanding of scripture, all of which just stifle the Holy Spirit within us? If someone comes into my church building during worship and wants to dance and lift their hands and clap, and I am uncomfortable with that, it would be better for me to have a millstone around my neck and thrown into the sea than to cause that child of God to stumble and lose faith. The opposite is true as well. If a well-meaning elderly person wants to worship in a somber way, who am I to force him to get all emotional right then? This throws a wrench into OUR idea of orderly worship, but I think it is important to consider what we’ve done to hinder the Holy Spirit during a time of praise to God. As for the other 167 hours of the week, the Holy Spirit should be our filter as we read the Word of God, and the Word of God should be our filter for everything around us. I’d like to discuss the idea of church community too, but I’ve already jabbered on enough. Sorry.
Great words Jason, you seem to have thought/studied about the Spirit a great deal. I like your thoughts on 1 Cor. 14 We do stifle our spirit when we stifle The Spirit. On the other hand, the Spirit also works I believe when someone is working on a message all week long to present to the body. So there has to be some balance. Unfortunately the scales have been tipped to the "decently and in order" side and many are too afraid to balance that out. Listening quietly, most of the time, Pat Arthur
Wow, Jason, good thoughts expressed well! Thanks.
We'll start a new post on Sunday, where we can talk about community as we talk about the vine and branches of John 15; it is a passage about community (and other things).
I think one of the greatest challenges as a church leader is hold together all the diversity in a church. The key is the Spirit and his desire to bring about unity while recognizing and celebrating diversity. First Corinthians is about that, especially chapters 12-14.
Thanks, everyone for reading! And especially thanks to all posters.
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