John 7:28-39
Jesus answered, "My teaching is not my own. It comes from him who sent me. If anyone chooses to do God’s will, he will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own. He who speaks on his own does so to gain honor for himself, but he who works for the honor of the one who sent him is a man of truth; there is nothing false about him. Has not Moses given you the law? Yet not one of you keeps the law. Why are you trying to kill me?" "You are demon-possessed," the crowd answered. "Who is trying to kill you?" Jesus said to them, "I did one miracle, and you are all astonished. Yet, because Moses gave you circumcision (though actually it did not come from Moses, but from the patriarchs), you circumcise a child on the Sabbath. Now if a child can be circumcised on the Sabbath so that the law of Moses may not be broken, why are you angry with me for healing the whole man on the Sabbath? Stop judging by mere appearances, and make a right judgment." At that point some of the people of Jerusalem began to ask, "Isn’t this the man they are trying to kill? Here he is, speaking publicly, and they are not saying a word to him. Have the authorities really concluded that he is the Christ ? But we know where this man is from; when the Christ comes, no one will know where he is from." Then Jesus, still teaching in the temple courts, cried out, "Yes, you know me, and you know where I am from. I am not here on my own, but he who sent me is true. You do not know him, but I know him because I am from him and he sent me." At this they tried to seize him, but no one laid a hand on him, because his time had not yet come. Still, many in the crowd put their faith in him. They said, "When the Christ comes, will he do more miraculous signs than this man?" The Pharisees heard the crowd whispering such things about him. Then the chief priests and the Pharisees sent temple guards to arrest him. Jesus said, "I am with you for only a short time, and then I go to the one who sent me. You will look for me, but you will not find me; and where I am, you cannot come." The Jews said to one another, "Where does this man intend to go that we cannot find him? Will he go where our people live scattered among the Greeks, and teach the Greeks? What did he mean when he said, ‘You will look for me, but you will not find me,’ and ‘Where I am, you cannot come’?" On the last and greatest day of the Feast, Jesus stood and said in a loud voice, "If anyone is thirsty, let him come to me and drink. Whoever believes in me, as the Scripture has said, streams of living water will flow from within him." By this he meant the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were later to receive. Up to that time the Spirit had not been given, since Jesus had not yet been glorified.
Please read all of John 7.
How does the crowd try to determine the identity of Jesus?
How is "Scripture" used in this chapter?
What does Jesus say about the Holy Spirit?
Sunday, June 22, 2008
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18 comments:
So how's it going where you are?
Allen, I am speaking at North Central through Wednesday for the Adult Class in their VBS. Just to seek prayer... We are having a HOMECOMING here at The Avenue Church July 18-20, inviting people that have attended here in the past. There are several that have been contacted that do not attend anywhere at this time. Pray that this will touch hearts to return to the Lord. On Sunday afternoon there will be a group from the Kingsley Terrace church in Indianapolis to sing for us at 1:30. That is where I am this week! Have a great day! Pat Arthur
Hey Pat, what do you think this is - an announcment board?? ha ha. Hope all those things go well.
Kedra and I are in Nashville, along with Luke, for his Lipscomb orientation. I may write more about it later, but in case I don't I'll just say that we have been impressed with the ways things are here.
I came across this this morning. I'm not really surprised by it, but I find it pretty troubling.
Americans: My Faith Isn't the Only Way
The Christian Post reports that a new religious survey found that 57 percent of evangelical church attendees believe many religions lead to eternal life. The study, conducted by Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life, is interpreted by some as a sign of increasing religious tolerance, while others bemoan it as indicative of growing religious ignorance and relativism. Among the 35,000 adults surveyed, 68 percent of Americans said there is more than one true way to interpret the teachings even of their own religion. "The survey shows religion in America is, indeed, 3,000 miles wide and only three inches deep," said D. Michael Lindsay, a Rice University sociologist of religion. "There's a growing pluralistic impulse toward tolerance and that is having theological consequences," he said.
What do you think? John's gospel really presents Jesus as the only way to the Father.
allen
interesting read although like you i saw this coming and didnt take it as a suprise. we have had these discussions with our youngest daughter who has friends that are of different religions and she struggles with accepting that they are "wrong". this appears to be another example of the pendualum swinging. not sure what the answer is....
hope you all enjoy lipscomb and have a safe trip home.
rr
Allen,
I think it is easy to see where others are coming from when comparing christianity to other major religions. There are some striking similarities in religions of other cultures. However, we do miss the 1 major difference in that Christianity provides free salvation to those who accept the truth.
I think it would be interesting to see what our church thought about other religions... where to we fit in with this study? Do we have it all right or do we think the same things this study shows? If we do think that way, how do we show our congregation the truth in Jesus and that he is the ONLY way to Heaven?
Maybe we all really do believe Jesus is the only way but we are too scared to share the truth with others for fear of offending them?
I just preached this message on Sunday Evening at NC. The idea that "All religions are the same and lead to the same place" is very popular today. I know it is not from this part of John but Jesus does say I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. (John 14) Either he is right or he is lying... I will make more ANNOUNCEMENTS at a later date, thank you very much ;-), Pat
I'm not too surprised by those figures, I guess. Mainline churches went that direction a long time ago. I think people get confused about "tolerance," tho, and what that means. I think we can disagree wholeheartedly with someone, w/o thinking they're evil or stupid. Also, we can hold firmly to our beliefs, even try to convince others, w/o being obnoxious and narrow.
I'm interested in what contributes to these sorts of trends, and have ideas of my own. There always seems to be a tension between "liberal" and "conservative" in any religious movement, and I think things are swaying toward liberalism right now. Part of that may be that people don't want to identify too closely with fundamentalism. It may also be that people want to not only fit in at church, but in the world, as well. After all, intelligent, educated folks don't believe in all that narrow-minded, literalistic stuff in the Bible. Do they? ;)
Donna
Here are a few thoughts on a Wednesday after (as I try to keep my eyes open - wow, am I sleepy!):
A lot of my email is not getting to its intended recipients or getting there very delayed. Todd explained that someone broke into the server and “pirated” it and used it for spam. Now, if I understand it correctly, a lot of the other servers associate my email with spam. All hot mail is coming back, along with many others. I think it is supposed to eventually right itself. I hope so!
Luke’s Lipscomb orientation was so good and comforting. Lipscomb really has its act together. Missional theology runs deep through every department. We went to the college of natural and applied sciences to hear about the pharmacy program, because Luke is planning on becoming a pharmacist. We heard a little about the pre-med program. I believe 96% of Lipscomb’s pre-med students get accepted into med school, which is much higher than the national average. That’s impressive, but more impressive to me, was to hear the whole department talk about wanting their students to do service projects in the name of the Lord, home and abroad. The Dean of the college of pharmacy talked about how he hoped every pharmacy student will go on a foreign mission trip.
I read a helpful article this morning: Why can’t I shake my sins?
Interesting and helpful perspective. If you don’t struggle with sin, then wouldn’t you become proud? Really reminds me of Paul and his thorn in the flesh. You can read about that in 2 Cor. 12. It made me a little more appreciative of the struggle.
Have you heard about The Shack? I read about half of it yesterday. Fascinating. Disturbing. I’ll tell you more about it later. I will say that it is interesting to read it at the same time I am slowly reading a beautiful book about Andrei Rublev’s Holy Trinity icon. The Shack is also about the Trinity, but...
You know how we talked about communion last week, here and in the assembly? As I opened my mind some during the actual taking of the communion, I imagined Jesus sitting next to me, with his arm around me to provide support and comfort. I needed it. It was very real. How did you experience his presence last Sunday?
Here's a little bit about our passage this week. It is from Gail O’Day, a wonderful Johannine scholar at Emory:
“Each conversation in John 7 underscores the contrast between the reality embodied in Jesus–that he is sent from God (7:16,28,33)–and the crowd’s and authorities perception of that reality. Instead of allowing what they see in Jesus to redefine their understanding of God in the world, those who resist Jesus judge him according to pre-existent systems and structures that both cause and provide justification for their misperception. Jesus is measured against professed knowledge of who the Messiah will be (7:26-27, 41-42), of what Scripture says (7:48-52); the rigid certitude with which those expectations are held determines the judgment reach about Jesus. John 7:1-52 thus is configured to highlight the truth of 7:24, “Do not judge by appearance, but judge with right judgment.”
I wonder if we fall into the same traps of being so sure of our pre-conceived ideas about Jesus that we do not hear what he says?
I think this could be the case with other religions. We want everyone to be saved, which is good, but I think we base our views on our wants and not on what Jesus says.
If we believe everyone is saved in the end, then why evangelize? Why take being "sent into the world" as Jesus was sent seriously?
Jesus claims to be the exclusive way to Heaven, and he also sends us into the world to do his work, with a view of us showing him to the world so they will believe and be saved. Right?
Wow, you might want to watch THIS!
Brian F. sent it to several, including me.
Here's the story that goes with the video mentioned just above:
A son asked his father, 'Dad, will you take part in a marathon with me?' The father who, despite having a heart condition, says 'Yes'. They went on to complete the marathon together. Father and son went on to join other marathons, the father always saying 'Yes' to his son's request of going through the race together. One day, the son asked his father, 'Dad, let's join the Ironman together.' To which, his father said 'Yes'.
For those who don't know, Ironman is the toughest triathlon ever. The race encompasses three endurance events of a 2.4 mile (3.86 kilometer) ocean swim, followed by a 112 mile (180.2 kilometer) bike ride, and ending with a 26.2 mile (42.195 kilometer) marathon along the coast of the Big Island.
Father and son went on to complete the race together.
"If we believe everyone is saved in the end, then why evangelize? Why take being "sent into the world" as Jesus was sent seriously?"
Good question. But IMO easily answered. Everyone isn't saved in the end. Jesus said more than once who wasn't going to be saved, and who was going to be saved for eternity. He also gave more than once some simple 'rules'(my words, not Jesus's) one 'rule' is if you don't forgive others then you Won't be forgiven. If your not forgiven then you won't be accepted into Heaven (because there can be no sin in Heaven). another rule is if you don't love God with everything, and you don't love your neighbor the same, then it's a no go too. Well if you don't care enough about your neighbor to try to save them/evangelize to them then it's obvious that you don't care about them. therefore don't love them like God does. So the simple answer to your thought is to Love others means to try and get them to the rewards of Heaven and of God. Now do we all do a good job at that? NO. I know I don't, but to justify that most folks try really really hard and pray for grace to pull us through.
God didn't say "But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it" for nothing. And I think the word "few" should scare the fire right out of people, I know it scares it out of me..
good thoughts Allen, have a good day..
Jon Goller
on the video, just to put this in perspective. the world class guys complete this in around 8 hours. my buddies that i train with do this is around 10 hours. if you notice the sun is rising when they are swimming and when they START the marathon, it is already dark. the ability to do this is absolutely beyond my comprehension. again training with my buddies, i know what they do. also being a runner and bicyclist, i know that part too. wow!!!!
jon good points and as always very good comments.
allen your topic on about post four has been very news worthy this week. i also read where dobson says obama distorts the bible. very interesting.
rr
I don't know that I agree with Dobson that Obama distorts the Bible. But, I'm always wary when someone uses scripture in political situations, because they have a tendency to cherry-pick the passages that support their view, and exclude other passages that don't. But, I suspect we all do that.
Donna
p.s. That Dad in the video better have gotten something really good for Father's Day!
OK, I am a little behind cause I just read the blog this week :o) I want to comment on that survey. I think that the reason that people say there is more than one way to interpret the Bible is because (and I think Donna said this in another situation) we tend to pick and choose the passages that suit our needs. We ignore the tough ones that deal with things we don't want to hear. Sad but true. Also, the Bible is very clear that Christ is the only way to Heaven, but there is more than one religion that believes that. A big example is the difference between "Church of Christ" and Christian Churches". The big difference comes in the "instruments" used in worship. This is an interpretation of the passages in the Bible. Church of Christ believe there should be no instrumental music while Christian churches don't see it that way. They see the intruments as another means of worship. Does this mean they are not going to Heaven? They believe you can only get to Heaven thru Jesus just like we do. What's everyone elses take on this? Just curious.
Have a great day!
Diane
I think you are right Diane. When the question was asked I wonder if they made it clear? I too would have answered yes, but meaning like you just described with another Jesus believing chruch. I personally don't think there is anything wrong with music in chruch, but that didn't stop me from going to MCOC like I was being led to do.
Annette
Hey, I've been trying to take a little "down time" for the last couple of days, but I will briefly respond to Diane and Annette's commments.
I think the conversation is about Christianity vs. other world religions. Christianity makes exclusive claims, which is why it is hated so much, at least in part.
Trying to sort different beliefs within Christianity is always difficult, I think. A great deal of caution is required.
I think of this passage quite a lot:
Mark 9:38-40
“Teacher,” said John, “we saw a man driving out demons in your name and we told him to stop, because he was not one of us.”
“Do not stop him,” Jesus said. “No one who does a miracle in my name can in the next moment say anything bad about me, for whoever is not against us is for us.
A few years ago I taught class at church about our history. I took a written, anonymous survey as we started the class. One question regarded instrumental music. Two out of 60 said that it was a sin that would lead to condemnation. I don't think it's that huge of an issue for most folks. Non-instrumental worship, which is simple, is a part of our identity.
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